Legislature(2001 - 2002)

03/19/2001 01:36 PM Senate HES

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
          SB  86-TEACHER EMPLOYMENT & SUBJECT EXPERTISE                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PETE KELLY, sponsor of SB  86, informed the committee that                                                              
he  introduced  SB 86  in  response  to  the widespread  need  for                                                              
teachers  in the  state.   SB  86  does not  attempt  to cure  the                                                              
shortage;  instead  it gives  school  districts  another arrow  in                                                              
their quiver  to deal with  this problem.   He noted  the American                                                              
Federation  of  Teachers  and  the   Alaska  Teacher  Preparedness                                                              
websites both  make reference  to graphs  they have prepared  that                                                              
show a  significant decrease in  the number of  teacher applicants                                                              
and the number of people attending  teaching job fairs. One reason                                                              
for  the  shortage  in  Alaska  is   that  it  simply  is  not  as                                                              
competitive as it  has been in previous years.  SB  86 would allow                                                              
school districts to  hire people with Bachelor's  degrees and five                                                              
years experience  in subjects they  are hired to teach.   Subject-                                                              
matter teachers  would not be  treated the same  regarding tenure,                                                              
because  if  a  district  eliminates  a  certain  class  from  its                                                              
curriculum, that teacher  would not have tenure  over teachers who                                                              
are certified  to teach  a broader  range of  subjects.   Subject-                                                              
matter teachers would be held to  the same level of accountability                                                              
when it  comes to security matters,  which are already  in statute                                                              
and regulation.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN  GREEN  asked  Senator  Kelly  if he  is  referring  to                                                              
criminal background checks.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY  said that is  correct and includes  fingerprinting.                                                              
He  commented  that many  people  with  teaching degrees  work  in                                                              
different professions,  and many people in other  professions wish                                                              
to be teachers but do not have teaching  credentials.  SB 86 is an                                                              
attempt  to put  qualified  people who  have  a lot  to offer  the                                                              
system in the  classroom to alleviate the teacher  shortage Alaska                                                              
is experiencing right now.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WILKEN  asked how a fee  would be established  for subject                                                              
matter teachers,  whether they would  be eligible  for retirement,                                                              
and whether a  school board or DOEED would determine  whether they                                                              
are qualified.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY said the local school  board would determine whether                                                              
an applicant is qualified and would  require that person to take a                                                              
competency  exam.   He tried  to  leave the  other issues  Senator                                                              
Wilken raised up to the local school  boards.  It is his intention                                                              
to allow  school principals  to either  opt into  this program  or                                                              
remain out of it.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WILKEN asked for clarification of pay and retirement.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY  said they  would be considered  teachers as  far as                                                              
school districts are concerned.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WILKEN  asked if  they would fall  under the pay  scale at                                                              
the time of hire.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY  said he  knows of nothing  in the legislation  that                                                              
would preclude that and it was not  his intention to do otherwise.                                                              
Regarding retirement,  he said  they are  teachers in every  sense                                                              
except for tenure.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WILKEN  asked  if  they   would  become  members  of  the                                                              
bargaining unit.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY said that is correct.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD asked if subject-matter  teachers will have to pass a                                                              
test.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY  referred to  page 2, line  17, and pointed  out the                                                              
bill requires  the local school  board to administer  a competency                                                              
test [page 2, line 27 of the committee substitute].                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR LEMAN referred to Martin  Gross, an author who wrote about                                                              
failures  in the  American education  system, and  said Mr.  Gross                                                              
recommended that  undergraduate schools of education  be done away                                                              
with because  they are  turning out generalists  that do  not know                                                              
their subject  matter well  enough.  He  suggests that  people get                                                              
undergraduate  degrees in subject  areas and  then get  a graduate                                                              
degree in  education.  Senator Leman  said he tends to  agree with                                                              
that approach.   He asked why not allow school  districts to reach                                                              
into the  communities to find people  with the right  expertise to                                                              
teach.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY mentioned  the committee substitute  has a provision                                                              
for a mentoring  program to last  at least one year  for secondary                                                              
school teachers.  He felt that provision to be a good idea.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WARD moved  to  adopt CSSB  86(HES),  Version  L, as  the                                                              
working document of the committee.   There being no objection, the                                                              
motion carried.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KELLY noted  the University has a one  year Master's level                                                              
teaching program but that program  will not work for the people he                                                              
has in mind.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN pointed out the  one-year program is a fast-track                                                              
program, while the mentor program  will teach the incoming teacher                                                              
the systems  and protocols  of the district.   She added  that she                                                              
could see  value to  mentoring with  several teachers.   She  then                                                              
asked for public testimony.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 1470                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
DR.  BRUCE  JOHNSON,  Deputy Commissioner  of  the  Department  of                                                              
Education and  Early Development,  said DOEED appreciates  Senator                                                              
Kelly's concern  for the  teacher shortage  issue and the  changes                                                              
made  in  the  committee  substitute,  particularly  the  mandated                                                              
competency exam,  the mentoring program and  Professional Teachers                                                              
Practices  Commission  (PTPC)  oversight.    The  state  board  of                                                              
education has also been working on  the teacher shortage issue and                                                              
has  issued three  regulations.   It  has  proposed a  provisional                                                              
certificate, which will  allow DOEED to request it  to recognize a                                                              
teaching certificate  from any  other state for  up to  a two-year                                                              
period of  time.  During that  two-year period, the  teacher would                                                              
have  to fulfill  Alaska requirements.   Another  proposal is  for                                                              
specialty endorsement  so that with a minor in  special education,                                                              
a person  could qualify for  an endorsement in  special education.                                                              
The state  board will  also be  looking at  adjusting some  of the                                                              
certification fees for licensure.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
DR. JOHNSON said, in response to  Chairwoman Green's comment about                                                              
licensure, that the Type M Certificate  is available for  military                                                              
science,  vocational education  and Native  culture and  language.                                                              
He recently  noticed that  Alaska has  in excess  of 200  of those                                                              
certificated  teachers.  A  few  districts  have  35  or  40  such                                                              
individuals,  primarily  in  rural  Alaska,  certified  in  Native                                                              
culture and  language. That has  proven to be  a useful tool.   He                                                              
noted the  concept of SB  86 has been  tried in other  states with                                                              
success  and failure.  One  of the  challenges  other states  have                                                              
faced is a high number of attrition.  He cautioned that it appears                                                              
to be a little  easier than it actually is and  the result has not                                                              
been improved student  achievement.  DOEED suggests that  if SB 86                                                              
moves forward, that the legislature  require these people to enter                                                              
into  a  professional  development   program  that  would  provide                                                              
teacher education  training.  He  suggested that DOEED  could work                                                              
with the  University of  Alaska (UA)  to design  a set of  courses                                                              
that could  be delivered in convenient  ways so that it  would not                                                              
place a huge  burden on these teachers but would  qualify them for                                                              
a Type A Certificate.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 1196                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WILKEN asked, if DOEED is  proposing a two-year window for                                                              
out-of-state certification,  when the  teacher would have  to take                                                              
the competency exam.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
DR. JOHNSON said they would have  to do that within the two years.                                                              
He said right  now, DOEED allows  teachers one year because  it is                                                              
inconvenient for teachers in rural areas to take the exam.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN  GREEN said  she understood  that to  be a  requirement                                                              
before a person could be hired.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
DR.  JOHNSON said  DOEED  is finding  that,  during  this time  of                                                              
teacher shortage,  people are hired one day before  school starts,                                                              
so DOEED cannot require the test  in that time.  He noted the test                                                              
is not administered on a daily basis.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN  said that practice needs  to be looked  at.  She                                                              
then asked  if a  person could  obtain credit  for working  with a                                                              
mentor,  as is  done  with internship  programs.   She  questioned                                                              
whether  all of  the  subject-matter teachers  need  to return  to                                                              
college  to take  methods  courses or  whether  they could  obtain                                                              
credit in other ways.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
DR. JOHNSON  said he believes  Chairwoman Green is  suggesting the                                                              
concept used by  the Masters of Arts in Teaching  (MAT) program at                                                              
the  University in  which  teacher trainees  spend  almost all  of                                                              
their  time working  with  students under  a  mentor. They  attend                                                              
seminars one  day per week  and attend  classes full time  for two                                                              
summer sessions.  The difference  between what Chairwoman Green is                                                              
suggesting and the  MAT program is that MAT students  are not paid                                                              
during  that  time.  MAT  students  make  a  tremendous  financial                                                              
sacrifice.  He informed committee  members that the state board of                                                              
education  worked  through  another  regulation  over  a  12-month                                                              
period.  That  regulation was targeted primarily  for rural Alaska                                                              
where some  instructional aides  have been  working at  their jobs                                                              
for 12  to 15  years but  they are  unable or  unwilling to  leave                                                              
their communities  to enter a university program.   The regulation                                                              
would allow the  University to secure a cohort of  students with a                                                              
provisional certificate,  have a mentor, be paid  by the district,                                                              
and be engaged  in a distance delivery teacher  education program.                                                              
All of  those things would provide  good incentives, but  DOEED is                                                              
finding it is  not very cost effective for the  University until a                                                              
certain number of individuals are interested.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN asked if a teacher  needs six hours of credits to                                                              
be re-certified every five years.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
DR. JOHNSON said that is correct.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN felt  that standard is too low  compared to other                                                              
professional   re-certification   requirements.   She  noted   the                                                              
discrepancy  between the  requirements  to get  certified and  the                                                              
requirements  to maintain  certification is  very big.   She  then                                                              
asked  if any  of  the  mandates in  SB  86 could  be  implemented                                                              
without legislation  and whether  DOEED could only  implement them                                                              
with emergency regulations.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
DR. JOHNSON said he would have to  review all of those regulations                                                              
but explained the state board of  education has fairly broad-based                                                              
discretion in terms of the types of certificates they issue.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 827                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR LEMAN  asked if the fact  that he has a Masters  degree in                                                              
engineering  would qualify  him to  take the  competency exam  and                                                              
teach physics  or mathematics.   He wanted  to know whether  SB 86                                                              
provides enough flexibility  in the writing of  the regulations to                                                              
allow for that.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
DR. JOHNSON said he believes so and  he thinks the example Senator                                                              
Leman provided is a logical conclusion  to draw.  He suspects that                                                              
if SB 86 passes,  DOEED would ask the district that  wants to hire                                                              
such an  individual to document  that individual's  background and                                                              
subject matter  expertise and propose the courses  that individual                                                              
would teach.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  LEMAN then  asked, regarding  the work  experience, if  a                                                              
legislative aide  with five years  of experience would  qualify to                                                              
teach as a subject-matter expert in government.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICH  KRONBERG, President  of NEA-Alaska,  said he  finds CSSB
86(HES) intriguing.   NEA-AK agrees  it is necessary to  deal with                                                              
the  teacher  shortage  issue  and   appreciates  Senator  Kelly's                                                              
efforts to  put together a  packet that clearly  demonstrates that                                                              
need.  He believes it is clear that  one of the factors behind the                                                              
problem is  that salaries  have not kept  pace, but the  fact that                                                              
working  conditions   in  many  school  districts   are  extremely                                                              
difficult also accounts for a 40  percent turnover rate in certain                                                              
districts.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
NEA-Ak believes the teacher shortage  issue should be solved using                                                              
a three-pronged  approach.  Alaska  needs to recruit,  retain, and                                                              
retrain teachers.   He believes CSSB  86(HES) falls into  the last                                                              
category.  NEA-Ak has many questions  about the retraining aspect.                                                              
NEA-Ak  agrees   with  Dr.  Johnson's   comments  that   a  future                                                              
commitment is  important from people  who attempt to  get subject-                                                              
matter  endorsements  so  that  they  will  engage  in  continuing                                                              
education to develop their skills  as educators.  He believes NEA-                                                              
Ak would  be very  interested in  working with  the University  to                                                              
develop an apprenticeship program if this legislation passes.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. KRONBERG said NEA-Ak has the following questions:                                                                           
   · What will the fiscal note be for CSSB 86(HES)?  The original                                                               
     bill had  a zero  fiscal note, but  a mentoring  program will                                                              
     have costs  associated with  it in terms  of time  and wages.                                                              
     NEA-Ak suggests  that mentors mentor teachers  in the culture                                                              
     in  rural  areas.   This  could  provide an  opportunity  for                                                              
     instructional aides to do the mentoring if they are from a                                                                 
     village.                                                                                                                   
   · Would this program be for secondary school teachers only?                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN said she believes  people could also teach at the                                                              
elementary level.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. KRONBERG thought  Senator Kelly was clear that  all people who                                                              
get  hired under  this  program  would have  to  meet  all of  the                                                              
requirements and that  they would be part of the  bargaining unit.                                                              
He  asked if  they  would be  required  to also  meet  all of  the                                                              
performance  standards that exist  for other  teachers.   He noted                                                              
some of those standards clearly deal with pedagogy.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN said she thought  it would go without saying that                                                              
would be a requirement.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. KRONBERG said that is the answer NEA-Ak wanted to hear.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN asked  that Mr. Kronberg and Dr.  Johnson talk to                                                              
the sponsor about their concerns.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. KRONBERG agreed to do so.  He  pointed out that, regarding the                                                              
competency test, it  is his understanding that a  teacher could be                                                              
hired without  taking it  but could not  get a contract  because a                                                              
contract requires  licensure.  He stated some  teachers were hired                                                              
by the Anchorage  School District on substitute pay  and when they                                                              
did  not pass  a portion  of the  test,  they had  to continue  on                                                              
substitute status because they were  unable to get a contract.  He                                                              
felt the  basic concern is that  this legislation may not  do what                                                              
it is  intended  to do.   He said  NEA-Ak's data  agrees with  Dr.                                                              
Johnson's  statement  that  many  other  states  have  found  that                                                              
subject-matter teachers  do not remain in the  profession for more                                                              
than  three  years  unless  there  is  some  coherent  program  of                                                              
induction, including mentoring.   Without that, Alaska may just be                                                              
creating a "revolving door".  He  also believes the state needs to                                                              
deal  with  the  problems  that  drive  teachers  out  of  certain                                                              
districts,  such  as  inadequate  housing and  lack  of  community                                                              
support.   He stated that NEA-Ak  is not opposed to  CSSB 86(HES),                                                              
but it  has serious questions  about its implementation  and would                                                              
like  them  answered  before  it  can lend  its  support  to  this                                                              
legislation.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 117                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN  GREEN  noted  that several  years  ago,  her  daughter                                                              
graduated from college  as a Spanish major.  At  the time, Wasilla                                                              
High  School could  not  find a  foreign  language  teacher.   Her                                                              
daughter  could have  successfully  filled that  position for  one                                                              
year, but  the high  school was  unable to  hire her.   Chairwoman                                                              
Green  felt  Alaska  has  lost  a  lot  of  opportunities  to  put                                                              
qualified people in the classroom.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 02-26, SIDE A                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR LEMAN questioned  whether the competency exam  is a multi-                                                              
subject test or  whether a person would only have  to pass the one                                                              
subject area he or she plans to teach.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. KRONBERG said  it covers the subjects of reading,  writing and                                                              
math.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN asked if it requires  any subject area expertise.                                                              
                                                                                                                                
DR.  JOHNSON  explained   that  DOEED  only  requires   the  basic                                                              
competency test but the Educational  Testing Service offers a test                                                              
in  each subject  area  as  well, so  a  district could  use  that                                                              
vehicle to require a subject area test.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. KRONBERG  commented that  NEA-Ak has  not had any  discussions                                                              
about pay for performance in Alaska  but he cannot imagine that if                                                              
a district  brought a serious proposal  to the table, any  of NEA-                                                              
Ak's bargaining units  would reject it out of hand.   He noted the                                                              
difficulty with  pay for  performance is the  need to  measure the                                                              
added value  of an individual teacher.   A teacher cannot  just be                                                              
held accountable for the absolute  results in a classroom because,                                                              
for example,  what a 7th  grade teacher is  able to do  depends on                                                              
what  happened  during  the  first six  years  of  that  student's                                                              
education.  Alaska does not have  any systems available to measure                                                              
the value a teacher is adding.  Other  states are working on those                                                              
systems but they are not fine tuned yet.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR LEMAN  said he knows  a system is  in place to  choose the                                                              
teacher  of the  year by both  districts  and the  state.  He  has                                                              
participated in that process and  has been very impressed with the                                                              
people who  have been  the finalists.   He agreed  that a  pay for                                                              
performance  program  may  be  difficult   to  implement,  but  he                                                              
believes it is a worthy idea.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There  being no  further business  to come  before the  committee,                                                              
CHAIRWOMAN GREEN adjourned the meeting at 3:20 p.m.                                                                             

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